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Debaclation Nation

Welcome to the new Debaclation Nation, a fancy title for this Web site's new poll center.

Each week, I'll post an interesting (or boring) Debaclation Nation poll so you can vote and argue over it. I'll keep the Debaclation Nation polls archived, so you can go back and keep arguing or see who was right.

So much for the new CBA being signed on Thursday. Who has been the bigger jerk in the past 24-48 hours, the players or the owners?

July 22

No CBA: Who has been the bigger jerk in the past 24-48 hours, the players or the owners?

We all thought football was saved. When the NFL owners finished up their 2-hour lunch and voted 31-0 (Al Davis abstaining, of course, because it was daytime so he couldn't go outside since he melts in the sun), we all thought the CBA was a done deal.

Well, at least the people on Twitter thought so. From what I read in my timeline, all of us football fans were happy - until, that is, the NFL players alerted the media that they would not be voting on the CBA on Thursday night, and according to George Wilson, perhaps not on Friday night either.

The NFL players haven't had enough time to look at the document. That's fair. However, players like New Orleans' Heath Evans, Jacksonville's Mike Sims-Walker and Buffalo's George Wilson expressed their frustration via Twitter and the actual media, citing that the NFL owners have deceived them by putting stuff into the CBA that was never agreed upon.

So, are the NFL owners sly douche bags who put pressure on the NFL players as a PR move? Perhaps. But something isn't right. Evans and Wilson complained about new stuff being in the CBA, yet they say they haven't even seen it. Evans admitted as much on NFL Network. Wilson, meanwhile, was asked repeatedly by Paul Burmeister why he couldn't, in his own words, take the new agreement to his teammates. Wilson ducked Burmeister's question each time. I watched the interview with my dad as we were eating dinner. The third time Wilson avoided the question, my dad bellowed, "F*** you, a**hole, you're not answering because you're a f***ing liar!"

Here's my take on all of this nonsense - the owners did in fact use Thursday's stunt as a PR move, but it wouldn't make sense for them to change the agreement of the CBA. I just believe that the NFL players feel disrespected that the owners did it this way, and they may unfortunately delay voting on this CBA out of pure stubbornness.

Let's hope it doesn't come to that. Some NFL players often don't take to kindly to being disrespected because they believe respect should be served to them on a silver platter. However, we can only hope that they see the bigger picture - that they make money playing football, and they're going to lose their fan base - and as a consequence, their money - each day they delay signing this CBA.

As I tweeted (@walterfootball), "NFL players want more money. NFL players want fewer practices. I'd be happy just to play football for a living. #wewantfootball."

TRcasTitans31 quickly replied to me, "Owners want more money and slipped unapproved things into the CBA, I'd be happy just to be a billionaire. Works both ways." Not quite. The owners own the teams. They can do whatever they want. It's their business. NFL players, meanwhile, don't have to play football. They're free to sell insurance, drive trucks or flip hamburgers. No one's forcing them to play football, despite what Adrian Peterson may think.

But the NFL players won't sell insurance, drive trucks or flip hambugers because they have a far better job than 99.9 percent of the people in America. But for some reason, they just don't seem to realize that.

That's my take. I think the NFL players are the bigger jerks, but don't let me sway you either way. Vote on whom you think is the bigger jerk, and discuss it in the comment board below the poll.

Debaclation Nation

No CBA: Who has been the bigger jerk this past 24-48 hours?

Version 2.03

Football Please!! 07-22-2011 12:52 pm xxx.xxx.xxx8.34 (total posts: 2)

I couldn't agree more Walt. Another thing driving me crazy is since when does an employee make the same about of money his employees do??? Hello, the owner of a business should make the most profit, because they have all the risk. I also would love to play football for a living instead of getting fat sitting at a desk all day.

n4ry4 07-22-2011 12:49 pm xxx.xxx.xxx54.3 (total posts: 4)

"The owners own the teams. They can do whatever they want. It's their business. NFL players, meanwhile, don't have to play football. "
-- -- --
This goes both ways though. Owners AND Players can BOTH do whatever they want.

NFL owners don't have to operate football teams if they don't want to. If they don't like player costs, owners can sell insurance or flip burgers too if they don't like being in the football business.

Owners have just as much right to demand lower labor prices from players as players have to demand higher wages from owners. In a free country, people have as much right to form business organizations as they have to form labor organizations, if they think either option can benefit them economically.

There is not some eminent moral law that says whatever ownership wants is more "right" or "fair" than whatever labor wants. or vice versa. Although I'm sure owners would like you to think there is.

I bet if the tables were turned--if the players beat the owners to the punch--holding a vote on a deal which may or may not (we can't judge until we have all the facts) be the original agreed-upon deal, then fans and the media would be putting serious heat on ownership to accept a deal.

Fans (mostly) don't care if the deal is good for players or owners. They just want a deal so football can resume. So, whatever side votes to approve a deal is going to be the "good guy", at least at that point in time. The other side gets to hear all the cries of "Just sign it already, you spoiled [millionaire athletes/billionaire owners]!!!" (whichever side it is)

Scavenger 07-22-2011 12:47 pm xxx.xxx.xxx.105 (total posts: 4)

@ironduke...You don't think that America would watch Joe Schmoe? I sure would...I'm not talking about Schmoe that is a couch potato. I'm talking about all the Schmoes that almost made it into the NFL. How much of a difference is there between some really good guys on the practice squad vs. the ones on the team. If they opened camp up like it was an American Idol and had people compete to get a position you don't think that that would start an amazing fan base (in this reality TV world we are in?). I'd love to see it happen for just one year to show these puke players that in the true form of entertainment...you can always be replaced.

PSUfolife 07-22-2011 12:32 pm xxx.xxx.xxx5.23 (total posts: 1)

I honestly feel like there is no side to blame here. Obviously, since the owners voted to approve they knew it would put the public pressure on the players. But in the players defense they have been telling the media time after time that they don't have a deadline, and that they aren't going to agree until their ready. ESPN and PFT have been making the reports each day that the players "should sign by tonight" or "should have a vote today", making us fans feel like this is going to be an easy All Yes vote on this and that the players shouldn't have a problem. I really don't blame the players for reading over this, making sure they know everything in the CBA and that it makes sense to them.

Having said that, Evans and Wilson are douches. I don't think De Smith has done a good job informing player reps, and it seems very few reps know exactly whats going to be or what should be in the CBA. Their jumping to their own conclusions like uninformed hacks and putting their ideas to the public where they deserve to be scrutinized.

A dumb-ass power play was made by the owners and it backfired. Now the players are trying to make one and it's backfiring on them.

luke 07-22-2011 12:22 pm xxx.xxx.xxx.250 (total posts: 1)

im with the players. they know their careers will only last about 5-10 years, so they want to get as much as they can while they can. i can understand that.

IBleedMidnightGreen 07-22-2011 12:12 pm xxx.xxx.xxx.198 (total posts: 1)

I feel like the players are the dbags here. Reminds me of the Chris Kluwe tweet... "Sigh, and once again greed is the operative byword. Congrats Brees, Manning, Mankins, and Jackson for being 'that guy'. #douchebags"

Ben S 07-22-2011 12:07 pm xxx.xxx.xxx3.49 (total posts: 1)

Everyone blames the players because their salaries are completely out in the open and they are seen as whiners b/c they make millions. Well the owners make billions and if their money wasn't going into the players pockets then it would just be these rich A-holes getting even richer. Furthermore, how can you blame players for trying to make as much money as they can, when you would do the same thing in their shoes. No matter what your profession you are going to try and make as much as you can. The only difference is you can go to a competing company, whereas they are confined to having to play in the NFL to make top dollar.

Also if you want to talk about athletes being overpaid, take your venom out on MLB or NBA players. The average NFL player's career only lasts for 3 years and makes a little bit more than $1 million a year. Obviously that is a pretty good salary, but with a short earning period, being in a high tax bracket, and a high risk of injury and long-term brain damage their are quite a few things that diminish the benefits of playing football for a living...certainly more than other professional sports.

ironduke 07-22-2011 12:03 pm xxx.xxx.xxx.169 (total posts: 8)

@Scavenger - No one would watch the Joe Schmoes and the NFL would no longer exist.

ironduke 07-22-2011 12:02 pm xxx.xxx.xxx.169 (total posts: 8)

@Jake - Most of the players don't live in Mansions & drive Bentleys. And most of them only play for a few years. And 90% percent of the population doesn't have to ability to be a NFL player.

Kyle B. 07-22-2011 11:43 am xxx.xxx.xxx.103 (total posts: 1)

The players have been trying all sorts of angles to try to gain a PR advantage throughout this whole lockout, so I think it's unfair for them to be grumpy just because the owners pulled a really good move on them. The players like Heath Evans just need to shut up, stop being paranoid, and let the "experts" go through the finishing touches of the deal and relay what changes (if any) were actually put in by the owners.

Matt S. 07-22-2011 11:17 am xxx.xxx.xxx4.89 (total posts: 1)

i wouldn't even play for 40,000 you let me hang out with Tom Brady and i'll do it for free!

Jake 07-22-2011 11:13 am xxx.xxx.xxx.246 (total posts: 2)

It's no doubt the players. Let them get a real job and work for minimum wage, rather than league minimum salary($~300,000. Do they know how vastly over paid they are to play a game that 90% (probably more) of the male population would play for 40,000 dollars a year. I understand this is a business and the NFL is a huge business, but the players need to sit back and realize they get to play football for a living and even the lowest salary guys will still likely make more than us middle class people. Quit being greedy, quit buying Bently's and stuff you don't need then complaining the NFL doesn't pay you enough.

Mitch 07-22-2011 10:37 am xxx.xxx.xxx5.85 (total posts: 1)

you would be a fool to think it was not the players at fault

Scavenger 07-22-2011 10:33 am xxx.xxx.xxx.105 (total posts: 4)

The players are being douche bags. I'd really like it if the players refused to sign and allow the owners to go out and recruit brand new team members. No Drew Brees, No Peyton Manning...just a bunch of Joe Schmoes that want to play football..were good college level athletes and show these A-holes they can be replaced. We are in a horrible economy, many fine educated people are out of work. These moronic gladiators scoff at their millions....really? Let em go back groceries and wait tables for a living. The owners carry all the risk...they should get more...the players are expendable.

klunge 07-22-2011 10:10 am xxx.xxx.xxx9.19 (total posts: 1)

Anthony, you are sounding as ignorant as the players that foolishly agreed to those interviews. Owners trying to force players to sign a deal they don't want? What planet have you been on for the last 4 months? This deal is not some offer by the owners, it was NEGOTIATED BY NFLPA REPRESENTATIVES on the players behalf. And it's widely known that the owners made the bulk of the concessions. Jerk players are just trying to send a message that "you can't MAKE me do anything!" I hope they all rot.

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